Welcome And Why She’s Here

Dr Andrew Greenland 0:00

So welcome back to Voices in Health and Wellness. This is the podcast where we speak with healthcare practitioners, innovators, and leaders who are exploring new ways to improve patient care and health outcomes. Today I'm joined by Dr. Malea Jensen, an osteopathic physician and family practice doctor with nearly three decades of clinical experience. After spending nearly 27 years in traditional family medicine, Dr. Jensen made the decision to step away from the conventional practice model and create a very different approach, one centered on patient education, physiology, and helping individuals to better understand their own health data. So today we'll explore what led to that transition, what she's learned along the way, and how she's helping patients become more informed participants in their healthcare journey. Malea, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for joining me today.

Dr Malea Jensen 0:44

Thank you, Dr. Greenland. Thank you for having me.

Dr Andrew Greenland 0:46

You're

From Symptom Care To Prevention

Dr Andrew Greenland 0:47

very welcome. So maybe we could just talk a little bit about the journey. The journey that you've had into family medicine, osteopathic medicine, so right from the beginning, because you've been in this for 27 years working in family medicine.

Dr Malea Jensen 1:00

Yeah, 21. Exactly.

Dr Andrew Greenland 1:02

When you think back to the doctor you were at the beginning of that journey compared with the doctor you are today, what's changed most in the way that you think about health and medicine?

Dr Malea Jensen 1:12

Yeah, if I if I'm not mistaken, I think both of us have come from what I would consider a conventional medicine background. And we both know what that's like to treat end stage symptoms of chronic disease. But over the years I've realized that my mission has changed and it's shifting focus, what I would consider upstream instead of downstream, which I was doing, identifying patients' metabolic dysfunction, insulin resistance years before it turns into cardiovascular disease, strokes, diabetes, cognitive decline, but catching it early. I think one of the biggest hurdles that we face in root-cause medicine is getting patients and doctors to understand that standard conventional medicine is missing things before it actually happens. I believe my twenty-eight-year timeline is the ultimate roadmap of how a doctor successfully reclaims a career, clinical freedom, and a peace of mind. And I have escaped, I think I've escaped, hospital systems, insurance-driven clinics, which have forced me and other doctors into an assembly line where we have seven to ten minutes with a patient, and that practice timeline, it's impossible to perform preventative medicine in that type of system. And uh again, I spent the first 14 years of my life in my of my career checking corporate boxes. I worked for a hospital system, okay, and I realized that that system was not designed to fix health, it was designed to manage chronic disease symptoms. So leaving that system behind was my only way to what I consider treating a patient thoroughly. I closed my, as you described in the in the introduction, I closed my practice, my physical brick and mortar practice a year and a half ago. And I moved 100% online consultations. It was a major move. I can't lie, it was scary, but it cut my overhead costs, and it allows me to reach a global audience and target an audience that I believe it's people who want to learn more about prevention. So it completely changed my lifestyle, it transformed my life, and it's I believe it's made an impact on a lot of people's lives.

Dr Andrew Greenland 5:06

Really

The System Insurance Pharma Pressure

Dr Andrew Greenland 5:07

interesting. So was there was there a particular moment or moment when you started to question some of the conventional approaches that you previously accepted as standard practice? I'm trying to get to those points that kind of made you take this shift.

Dr Malea Jensen 5:20

Yeah, that shift probably occurred around, I mean, it had always been in my mind. Let me be perfectly honest. I wanted to do preventative medicine. But as when I was in corporate medicine, and I don't know how much I can really say, but when I was working for a corporate medicine, there were standards of care that I had to follow in order to get paid by insurance companies. Okay, and this this happened from I would say right around 2000, moving forward, when we started getting electronic health records and all of that in into my practice. We were at first it was voluntary, where you would have goals, meet goals for blood pressure, meet goals for diabetes, meet goals for lipids, meet goals, and if you met those goals, you would get incentivized. Well, I pretty much kind of played my own game, saw my patients, did my thing anyway. You know, I would still teach them about diet, teach them about exercise, but it eventually got where there was a lot of pressure starting around 2016. Well, let's just say the the pressure began around 2008, where I did decided I did not want to sign an insurance agreement that would give incentivized kickbacks. Well, if one person in the group does not follow, none of them get paid, and so it was a situation where you know I basically had to move on, and that moving on just extended the whole process about four years, but didn't really change, okay. And so I've always known that there was something really, really wrong with how we were treating our patients and not giving them any type of informed consent. And to be perfectly honest, I wasn't educated enough to give them that informed consent. I mean, let's let's just be honest, okay. And I would say in 2016, that was another time in my life where I wasn't gonna play the games, I just couldn't play the games and be able to go to sleep at night, knowing that how I was treating patients, just prescribing them medications over and over and over again, was not doing anything for them. I even look, you know, I at first I was seeing 40-50 patients a day, right? Then I went down to 14 or 15 in my own practice in 2012. So I was seeing less patients making less money and still being had have no ability for a sovereign practice, even though I own my own practice. It it was it's um it was tough, but it was a blessing. I I can I cannot say it any other way. And I um I I've always had a heart for preventative medicine. I've I've exercised my entire life, I've been in bodybuilding, I've followed low-carb diets, I've done metabolically healthy things without even knowing what I was doing. Okay, and I basically went back to medical school in 2016 from my own personal education. I went deep dives into things that I knew had to be wrong or just not completely right. How about that? And have found out so much in the last 10 years that I feel like I've gone to medical school twice.

Dr Andrew Greenland 9:32

Amazing. So, how much of the problem that you were talking about is the is the medicine itself, and how much is it the system that the practitioners like yourself that were stuck in it? Or is it a bit of both?

Dr Malea Jensen 9:46

You know, I think it's a it's compounded, it's both of them. Um, I think they're in that it's that's interwoven with insurance companies and pharma. It is it it is a it's a weed, it's a weaved web, and it's I don't think I could separate it out because in order to to do one thing you have to do the other. It's um I I mean I I don't know how to say it any better way.

Dr Andrew Greenland 10:22

So for practitioners who are listening who recognize some of the frustrations that you've had, what do you wish was discussed more openly within healthcare?

Dr Malea Jensen 10:31

I think the fact, I mean, whoever is listening now, I think the fact that we were never informed, and we still aren't informed. There are there we were we were given this path in medical school, probably in undergrad. Okay. It is the way of the world. We were we were led in only one direction, and we were good little soldiers, we were good pawns, we followed their directions, we did what they asked us to do, and we did it for their benefit, not our benefit, not the patient's benefit. That's how I feel about it, okay. And I've always felt like I was under the thumb of somebody, and it was time to get out from under the thumb. Now, if that meant not practicing medicine anymore, that would have been my choice, okay? Because it was just, you know, I believe a career, the amount of education I went through to only get one side of the story was really a disgrace.

Dr Andrew Greenland 11:42

Thank you. So, I mean, lots of practitioners probably become frustrated with the system, much like you have, but relatively few completely redesigned the way they work. So, what eventually made you say, I'm not just not gonna do this anymore? Is that that one thing that kind of just tipped it?

Dr Malea Jensen 11:58

I'm not sure that it was one thing, is it more so it was against my my own personal ethics? And I I was not, I mean, money is a great incentive, but it wasn't enough for me to sleep well at night, okay. But I understand how doctors can get trapped, they have a family, they have houses, they have college, they have all of these payments, and they will simply follow along and not cause any waves and go into retirement and do the thing, and that that's not me. I'm not saying I'm a complete rebel, I just have ideals and ethics, and something inside me told me that I was being brainwashed. Okay. I mean, I don't I don't know how to say it any other way, but I felt like I was being brainwashed, and I don't know what woke me up, I think it was God. God finally woke me up and said, I'm not gonna have you do this anymore.

Going Online And Losing The Label

Dr Andrew Greenland 13:15

And when you closed the physical practice in um, I think it was 2025, I think you said, what did leaving the conventional model give you back? I mean, not just professionally, but also personally.

Dr Malea Jensen 13:25

What did that pro give me an example? I'm not sure where you're leading me to.

Dr Andrew Greenland 13:30

Um, so you made a fairly big transition point in April 2025. You closed the physical practice. I just wondered when you've been working in that kind of model for a while, what did you get back by changing to something else? Um, obviously, there's professional things that you might experience, but did you get anything back personally from that transition?

Dr Malea Jensen 13:48

Yeah, I I I think the the biggest thing was me having a peace of mind. Yes, it ended all the brick and mortar. I mean, it it actually became a second job, you know, maintaining brick and mortar. I have no regrets. It was a beautiful experience, okay? But my lifestyle never changed. I was still working, clicking, doing clickety-clock work on the computer for the insurance company in order to get paid. Hit the check the boxes, hit the bullet points, and get paid. So I was still doing basically the same amount of work because they require more and more, and seeing less patients. Okay, so I got my life back, I got sovereignty back. I now feel that I have a purpose where I can reach a global population, I can see 3,000 people in a day versus 15. That is what I got back. Is that all for me? Absolutely not. In fact, it kind of put me on the back burner, it wasn't about me anymore. Although I will tell you that, you know, getting back my life and and peace of mind, that was for me, knowing that I did this for other people and myself. And even if I'm wrong, even if I am wrong, I'm getting people to use their brain. They are not using their brain. They look at a doctor, put them on a pedestal, and say whatever my doctor says, it must be true. That is the biggest lie.

Dr Andrew Greenland 15:41

Was there any part of you that wondered whether you had made a big mistake when you closed the physical practice?

Dr Malea Jensen 15:47

Oh, yeah, I was scared. I was scared, I was overwhelmed. I didn't have that, I didn't have any IT, I didn't have any ability to understand how to make videos. I had started making reels prior to my final decision. And honestly, Dr. Greenland, I probably would still be working in my physical office had my nurse not retired. She retired early, and she put me in a position that said, rehire somebody that has 14 years of experience who manages the entire office. Or try this, just try it. I couldn't see myself trying to find somebody to work and run the practice like she did. I put a lot of pressure on her, and she did phenomenal. Okay, she was excellent, but I think that was God's indication to say, listen, it's time. Make a change. I'll bless you with funds. I'll do, and honestly, I didn't really skip a beat as far as uh income change. And yeah, I mean, I I think personally, not having an office mentally, because we identify with being a doctor in an office, and now people ask me, um, are you retired? Well, no, not really. I still work, I you know, I'm I'm still doing it, but that isn't an emotional hit. And when doctors listening to me right now, I think they will understand that all of our identification is on a piece of paper with our license and that DR in front of us, and everybody knows that we work in an office and are a doctor and see patients, and that is a no longer. I will never go back to that, and that was very hard for me in a year's time, and I'm getting used to it, but I will tell you, it is an I don't want to say an ego because I don't feel like I have an ego, but it is a basically a part of our identification as a person. This is 30 some years of our life. We are doctor, okay, and it has with that goes along with that. It has it has merit, it has uh it has a lot that goes with it. You know what I'm saying? The words aren't coming to me, but it has it has responsibility, but it has fame and success and all of these other words that we identify with, you know. That part was hard.

Dr Andrew Greenland 18:49

Did you immediately know what the new model was gonna look like when you left, or was it a bit of a kind of jump into the unknown?

Dr Malea Jensen 18:56

I jumped into the unknown, but I had when my patients were asking me, I had all these big ideas of how I was gonna do it, you know. And it it was nothing like that, and it just actually just flowed. I just kept a schedule and continued to work, and nothing really has changed really from that day one, except for I'm seeing more clients before it's paid off in a year's time. You're eventually, you know, at the start, you're doing everything for free, and you're just giving out as much information as you possibly can. And at the same time, I was learning so much, so it was like fun to deliver all of this information. Now I'm delivering information still, but seeing people one-on-one and giving them motivation to make changes to understand their labs. That is what I love. I love helping people understand how to read their labs because they've been deceived for years.

Dr Andrew Greenland 20:04

So your

Deep Lab Reviews And Deprescribing

Dr Andrew Greenland 20:05

work looks very different now compared to before. Talk us a little bit about the model. What does it look like from a patient perspective who wants to come and see you as compared to what you were doing before in a brick and mortar?

Dr Malea Jensen 20:15

Sure. Yeah, in a brick and mortar, when a patient would come see me, they would call, sign up for an appointment, come for either acute care or their chronic diseases every four months. I would see them, we would get labs, and then I would call them with those lab results as I wrote on their either my nurse or myself would call them back, and they weren't very detailed notes at all. Like, hey, your uh liver function enzymes are high, you know, we need to back up you you might have some fatty liver, we probably should look into it, things like that. Very, very superficial, okay. And now I go line by line on labs, and I spend time learning about that patient's history. Not that I didn't know my patient's history before, but I really know my patient's history now, their lifestyle, their sleep, their family life, their job, their stress, whether they get outside, what kind of lights are they under, all of those things are now in my history of present illness. How am I getting to this person? Then I can put all of that together when I look at their labs and I'll say, Oh, you live on a farm and you have well water and you have high heavy metals. I would have never asked if I had a farmer, you know, I knew I had farmers, but I wouldn't go into like what chemicals are you using on your crops? Um, how's the soil? Have you chased the soil? Are you using well? No, there wasn't time. And so now that I go line by line and show these people what is going on with their labs and how we can prevent this, we can turn this around. But see, in their head, they have doomsday, their doctor. Has doomed them with cardiovascular disease and strokes and diabetes and and well, here's your medicine, which is just treating a symptom, it's not root cause. You could you could stop the medicine, you don't even have to be on the medicines. I do more deprescribing now than prescribing ever. Okay. And so that is a huge change. Is saying, why are you on that medicine? I don't know. My doctor wanted me on it, but you don't know the answer. Well, let's tell you why you were on it. Here's what I likely suspect. It's a lack of education in the entire population. They've been given, just like me, just like you, the exact same information, no matter if we're in the United States, the UK, wherever. It is pharma-driven, it's symptom-driven. We patted ourselves on the back, didn't we, when we made a diagnosis? We said, good job, good job. And then we knew what medicine. We prided ourselves to know what medicine would go with that diagnosis. It was a pride thing. I was so happy. Oh my gosh, that was so cool. I made a diagnosis and I knew exactly what to prescribe them. Big change.

Dr Andrew Greenland 23:22

So I think you spend um up to three hours on an individual case. I think you said before, correct me if I'm wrong. So how does because you and you also mentioned that you're able to reach more patients? So how do you um ratify you know spending huge chunks of time, far more time than you ever did before, with extending your reach? How does it all kind of work out?

Dr Malea Jensen 23:41

The reach comes from educating people online. My live streams on weekends, my reels during the week, that is where my reach comes in. And you know, my like I said, my mission now is informed consent. My mission now is to educate and get people to use their brains, think logically. Does do rewards come with that? Sometimes people will give me a super sticker or super chat or whatever, and you get five bucks, right? The part that feels gratifying is I helped answer a question that somebody had, and if that person had that question, 2,000 people might have had that exact same question. The people that come to me, I would say are not really in the middle anymore. They are the super really educated and they want reassurance that they're doing everything right. Dr. Jensen just needs you to go over these and let's just talk. Am I doing this right? And I was like, Yeah, you're doing you're you're doing this, or hey, I think you missed this. And then the on the other spectrum is the person who is so scared, so paralyzed to make a decision. They know that taking a certain medication might be detrimental, not right now, but down the down the long road. Okay, so they're against taking that, but don't know if they're making the right decision, so they are paralyzed, and then they have cognitive dissonance. Well, this doctor said this, and you're saying this, and how do I know who's right? Because you're relying on one person or two people now to give you all of the information, and you cannot do that. You need to self-educate yourself, and I encourage that. But reaching that one person who signs up with me and wants a consultation is getting everything of me. It's getting three hours, one one to two hours online talking to you, another one to two hours of me doing research behind the scenes at emailing back and forth and saying, Did you say that you exercised three or four days a week? How many hours do you sleep? Are you an endurance athlete or are you lifting weights? Um, you know, all of those questions back and forth, back and forth. Because I need to have all of the information in order to make a great analysis, and they appreciate that. That's what I can do one-on-one. What I can do for a global population is feed them full of information that they can go back and say, I don't know about that, I better go check it out, using their brain.

Dr Andrew Greenland 26:41

And through

Teaching Patients To Question Doctors

Dr Andrew Greenland 26:42

through the education that you do, um, this is all about empowering the patients. You know, you're educating them to be asking questions to give them the information. What does an empowered patient look like to you?

Dr Malea Jensen 26:53

Oh my gosh, an empowered patient looks like somebody who's not gonna get bamboozled by their physician. There's a lot of buffoonery out there, and patients I you know, I've had patients that say, I just wish you could come to the doctor's off or doctor's appointment with me. And I said, Yeah, it would be interesting to but honestly, having me empowered them also empowers me. I'm got I I always tell my clients or online, I tell them we're on a journey together. I'm learning it. You're I'm working and learning this, you're working, you're paying the bills, and I'm presenting you information, stuff you have never heard. Why haven't you heard it? Because we have been indoctrinated, bamboozled down one-way path. There's up they will tell us there's absolutely no other ideas, no other reasonings behind certain diseases, except for whatever pharma pays for. It's incredible to wake up. And yeah, as as I'm empowering them, I'm empowering myself.

Dr Andrew Greenland 28:14

What surprises patients the most when they start understanding their own physiology? What's that kind of our hard moments that patients have with you?

Dr Malea Jensen 28:22

It's fear, it's anger. They go through a lot of emotions. When I start telling them things, they get mad at first. They're mad at their doctor, they're mad at themselves for not knowing that. They go through a lot of anger. Then they go through fear. Am I making the right decision? How come no one else see? I'm in a minority, you're in a minority, okay? We're we're we're in a minority, and they're seeing a consensus of doctors following one path, and then there's these offsprouts like ourselves, and you're saying, Well, how do I trust you? Don't trust me, go look it up. Don't trust your doctor either. Go look it up. Learn how to question your doctor. You will find out their true selves when they dismiss you and say something to this effect, you know, we're not going to see eye to eye on things, so it might be best for you to find a different doctor. They dismiss the patient. If a patient does not align with them and do what they say, they're going to find a reason not to see that patient. And it's very putting the patient down, it really is. It's it's it's undermining the patient because of their ego.

Dr Andrew Greenland 29:52

If

The Statin Refusal That Changed Her

Dr Andrew Greenland 29:53

you could give every patient one principle for becoming a more informed patient, or more, yeah, more informed participant in their own healthcare, what would that be?

Dr Malea Jensen 30:02

Reading. Reading. Um that's how I went back to medical school is reading. I read, I mean, if I if I could show you my bookcase of the books I started reading, and I will tell you how this all started. When I said it was in 2016, I had a patient come to me. You you asked me about a tipping point. I'm gonna give you a tipping point. A tipping point was I had about two or three patients who absolutely refused to take a statin. And I said, Why? There's this study and this study, and I went through and I said, We we have all this information. Why why are you why don't you believe it? And there was one who I mean there was three, but there was one, an older gentleman, that he said, I care about you, Dr. Johnson. We are like friends, and I think you're wrong. And I just need you to look into this. He brought me seven books to read, not one, seven of them. He didn't force anything upon me. I would just like you to just look into it. Did I read all seven books? Yes. When I got done, I was literally wanting to quit medicine. I wanted to quit because I felt like I had hurt so many patients the past 20 years by my inability to look outside of the box. I didn't take the time to read. I did my continuing medical education, but that CME was the exact same medical school directives. I never left the box until after the seven books. And then I wanted to cry. I wanted, I was in disbelief. I said, How did I not know this? How did I not know this? Was I in it under a rock? It was tough. I thought I was gonna quit. I I really did. I felt like I had hurt people instead of helped people.

Making A One-Person Model Work

Dr Andrew Greenland 32:19

You've not only changed the way you practice medicine, you've had to build a completely different business model around it. What have been the biggest challenges and bottlenecks in making this all work for you?

Dr Malea Jensen 32:30

You know, Doc, the the biggest thing was accepting the fact that my identity isn't just DR doctor. I'm a person just like everybody else. I put my pants on like everybody else. I go to the bathroom like everybody else. And I had to I had to come to grips with sharing two two options. Quitting, I guess, would be another option, sharing truth, what I believed was truth, or continuing and deceiving not only the people, but deceiving myself. And I couldn't do it anymore. I could not do that.

Dr Andrew Greenland 33:30

I'm just thinking about um from a business point of view, you've completely changed models. I just wondered, particularly when you're spending up to three hours with the one-on-one patients, how do you kind of make it work? Because it's it is a very different model, and it's something you feel much more comfortable in. I'm just curious to know how it works out.

Dr Malea Jensen 33:47

I I spend my mornings really working on a patient, and I spend my afternoons educating myself. I used to not be as rigid when I first started, and now I'm I'm very rigid. I I go work out in the morning and just staying rigid, staying with a consistent schedule, and then spending that time. Some of them are are easy, okay? Some of them are straightforward, and I can get through them much easier, and others, I said go, something is just not right here. And I deep dive, and I could spend you know three hours, but at the time that I'm working on that patient, I'm also educating myself. Does that make sense? Because I'm reading and I'm digging even more questions. Yes, it relates to the patient, but it's also helping me for future patients. So could it eventually look like it's not three hours on a patient? Possibly, possibly. But I know I know me, and the education just doesn't stop. And but I'm very now I'm very rigid about my schedule, and that has helped, you know. I'm still working and learning, working and learning, helping people learning, helping people learning. I don't know if I would call it a business model. It's almost like it's a hobby model, it's my hobby model. I I don't have a business model. If you ask me, give me your business model, I'd say, yeah, I go from day to day. I don't even, and I got a I got a paper calendar. I you you know, yours are all fancy. You must have given me 10 reminders about this interview coming up. And I have nothing like that. I'll email them and say, you know, um, hey, we got this thing going on. You still on for it? Yep, we're good, we're good. Okay, I'll send you a text right before we we start. I mean, it's it's really ancient the way I do things.

Dr Andrew Greenland 35:55

And in your hobby model, as you called it, what are the things that cost you the most time and energy and money?

Dr Malea Jensen 36:03

Um money-wise, I I mean, not a lot. I you know, be I I did purchase a new computer, and I have to thank my listeners for helping me do that. That was amazing. Okay, so I you know, I have a computer that I've been using for um this this computer we're on right now is 14 years old, and people it convinced me I need a new computer, I need to speed things up, and so with their help, meaning their consultations, their super chats, their super whatever's super stickers, it has helped paper a new computer. My time is not much changed. My time is centered around educating myself so I can educate people. I do not want to be, I hate being wrong, and I hate giving bad advice. I just I work hard not to give bad advice. And when I tell a patient I don't know, I really don't know. There's no answer sometimes. What you've been told that was complete rock solid, it's not that might not be. And I'm gonna tell them why. So just think about this, just think like use your brain, just think about this situation. Does that sound legit to you? No, but how do you know?

Dr Andrew Greenland 37:35

I don't know, but it doesn't sound right, and so computer upgraded. If I gave you a magic wand and you could fix anything else in the business tomorrow, what would that be, if anything?

Dr Malea Jensen 37:52

If I could fix the one thing, it would still be, I believe, my peace of mind. Am I doing the right thing? I I question that, and then I'll have a day where I have no questions, but if I could in the and it uh again, uh the the magic wand, I I'm very blessed. I I really am. I have no regrets. Everything's been a learning experience. Even when I was bamboozled with buffoonery, I have no regrets. And so if you gave me a magic wand, you know what? It'd be it'd be okay, but I I'm just in a in a process on a journey to learn, and the magic wand would say, Calm down, you're okay, you can do this. That would be it.

Dr Andrew Greenland 38:49

Where does that validation come from at the moment? Obviously, the magic wand is a theoretical construct, but where do you get the validation from?

Dr Malea Jensen 38:57

Definitely the clients. Um, when they when they give a a compliment, or it's not even a compliment, it's a thank you. I've been thanked so many times that I hadn't gotten in the previous 27 years from my brick and mortar clients patients. They felt obligated to come in. In order to get their prescription, I needed to check their their labs. I was not gonna just do a year's. I I can't, because if I miss something, that's on me, not on you. They did not want to come in sometimes, they didn't want to get my wrath, right? They didn't want to hear me say one more time or ask one more time, what does your exercise look like? What does your sleep look like? What are you eating? They didn't want it. These people want it. It is totally different. Clientele, they want education, they they desire it. They're paying out of pocket, they're not using insurance. These people want to learn, they want to heal, they do not want to take medications. It's a different clientele. I love it, they thank me. It feels good. That is validation. That that's my validation is the client saying, You're okay, you got this. Thank you so much. You're you're putting out there what no one else will do. And when they say no one else, they know that they're following other people with our with like-minded ideas, okay? So I'm not like the only one, but it's we all have the same. I bet if you were asked all of the like-minded docs on there who left their pride, they would all have this exact same scenario if they were honest.

Dr Andrew Greenland 41:03

So,

Independence And Final Thoughts

Dr Andrew Greenland 41:04

what where does the where's the future for you? What are you looking to do um maybe in the next year or so? Um, I guess you're not gonna be retiring anytime soon. So, what's the kind of future hold for you?

Dr Malea Jensen 41:14

I think just continuing what I'm doing and continuing to learn. I'm not, you know, I'm not one of those um docs that's gonna start opening up a business, hire a whole bunch of online coaches and that people hire Dr. Jensen for Dr. Jensen. They don't hire Dr. Jensen to talk to Dr. Jensen's health coach and me developing a health coach, and I teach them all, and then they go out and be disciples and do all that. I have no interest. The the reason people listen to me or want to talk to me or want to learn from me is they want me, not my assistant. And as long as I can do that, this platform will look exactly the same. I'll get better because I will I will be quicker. I imagine myself, this has only been a couple years, new three, four years education. It will start clicking even more. We're gonna we're I'm gonna get this. That's what my future looks like is this clicking. The dots are connecting right now. I got all these loose dots, and I'm helping people connect dots, but eventually the dots are gonna just like fall right into place.

Dr Andrew Greenland 42:28

And in closing, if there's one idea you'd like practitioners and listening to this conversation to take away and think differently about tomorrow, what would that be?

Dr Malea Jensen 42:39

Independence. They need to get back to using their own brain, they really do. I did, I needed to get back to using my brain. We have a ton of education, and we are allowing, I believe we are allowing an elite class run us over and use us for their agendas, and I I won't have it anymore. And it took me a long time to see where I needed to be me again, and I wasn't, I was them, and I identified with them, and I'm I I had to give up, you have to give up a lot, and that's what it's gonna take. It's gonna have you giving up your lifestyle and giving up your it the lifestyle will look different, it it's it surely will, but you the gratification is helping people. Well, if they say they're helping people now, I I just can't get on board with that. You're you're helping people be trapped in a system, and we can help that person and ourselves get out of a trap.

Dr Andrew Greenland 44:00

Manus, thank you so much for sharing your story. It's been very, really inspiring and such an honest reflection. And what strikes me most is the courage it takes to step away from a model you've spent years and decades building and creating something entirely different. And whether listeners agree with every perspective or not, I think there's tremendous value in hearing how experienced practitioners think through these challenges like you've done and how they're exploring new ways to serve patients. So thank you so much for your time today. I really appreciate the the honesty and the insights that you brought to the conversation. Thank you.

Dr Malea Jensen 44:29

Yeah, it's been an honor to be with you, and I want to thank you for inviting me on.